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Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.18 15:50:00 -
[1]
Originally by: Descrambled You know the more I think about it the more I like it. Delayed local would fix this issue so elegantly. If you want to be safe while ratting then encourage your corp/alliance to post guards on the gates. Isn't it supposed to be your space anyway?
Good idea lets waste x nr of accounts on watching paint dry while your profit goes down the toilet. Or if you want to be less of an idiot just use your accounts doing lvl 4 in empire for more isk and no risk. |
Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.18 21:14:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Khorin D'tael
Originally by: Hrodgar Ortal I'll support this the day my hulk can defend itself against the 5-10 gang that wishes no more than to kill it (since killing mining ships is very brave??).
Local is the only defense a miner has. Removing it means removing mining as a profession in anything but high sec.
It's an MMO! Can't you have scouts monitering the gates or do you want to be a miner like some ppl want to be a 1 man pwning machine in a MS or Titan and are disapointed when they discover they can't?
Why use 3 accounts to scout and one to mine when you can use all 4 to mine or do missions in empire? Do you really think that any player would actively "play" as a scout effectively sitting on a gate in a cov ops watching for enemies all day long (can eve be more boring?). Or maybe you think MMO means must have 4 accounts?
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Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.18 21:21:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Mikayla Grey on 18/06/2009 21:21:53
Originally by: Grath Telkin Edited by: Grath Telkin on 18/06/2009 21:11:03
Originally by: Sky Marshal Edited by: Sky Marshal on 18/06/2009 21:01:07
Another one who love waste time to do nothing and think that work is playing...
Is it wrong that I'm desperately awaiting the reset because of people like you?
Edit: To clarify, if you want risk free money making, you belong in EMPIRE (and honestly, from your posting, and obvious lack of back bone, you probably belong there anyway), if you are out in 0.0, you probably deserve to get blown up.
Chestbeating aside ratting in 0.0 without local is not smart, doesnt take balls, doesnt take skills(or maybe you think tolerating the incredible boredom of scouting is a skill). Its just stupid if your point is to make isk for your pvp ships. |
Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.19 00:09:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Mikayla Grey on 19/06/2009 00:10:56
Originally by: Santiago Fahahrri Edited by: Santiago Fahahrri on 18/06/2009 21:50:01 My corpmates and I would completely continue to rat in 0.0 with Local changed to Recent Speakers mode.
Those who have indicated that scouting involves sitting at a gate doing nothing for hours have a very limited understanding of what it takes to be a good scout.
As a member of (and primary scout for) a small, independant, 0.0 based corp I completely support changing local to Recent Speakers mode.
Sadly its you that are deluded in what a scout would need to do to protect ratters/miners.(Get into a 0.0 alliance with sov and see for yourself). Since the only place a scout can see an incoming cloaker gang is on the gate you would have to stay there. (Without local cloaks become vastly more powerful and as such vastly more popular)All the fun and games when doing fleet ops and travelling is completely irrelevant for the case of scouting for normal ratting in 0.0. And nomatter what the scouts do your isk making will suck if you use accounts to scout instead of running lvl 4 missions before even considering the possibility of ship loss.
Originally by: needrandomnamegenerator
one would think you'd be on the bus to put small gang warfare back in eve (because if you think its around now, your in deep need of therapy)
CCP made WH space specifically for small gangs, complete with pain in the ass logistics to keep it that way. Why are you not there?
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Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.19 00:22:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Mikayla Grey on 19/06/2009 00:24:07
Originally by: wtbrandomnamegenerator
First, please link me the dev comment that says they specifically made WH space for small gangs? I must have missed that.
Second, how does a system set up that can take you extraneous amounts of time to get out of help small gang pvp? What, we roam for 3 hours and see 6 systems because scanning for wormhole signatures takes so long to do?
That is probably the most flawed argument I've ever actually seen in print.
You've got a lot of balls calling somebody else deluded.
Try playing EVE. Limiting logistics is the only thing that will limit gangsizes. Why do you think they made WH gates limited? Just to be a pain in the ass? No its to keep the gangsizes small.
But it guess its much easier to demand that everyone else gets two scout accounts than spend some time scanning.
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Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.19 09:33:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Santiago Fahahrri
Dunno what to tell you beyond:
I've been in null sec for almost three years. I can't stand empire space. I've been in large alliances and I've now moved on to a small independent corp. In both situations I have personally been the scout in charge of defending the ratters and miners.
The small corp I'm in now spends all it's time in null sec without sov. We get hunted all the time by alliances who think we have no right to do what we do. We do it anyway. We would NEVER consider high sec and missions. We would LOVE local to be changed to Recent Speakers mode as it is in wormhole space.
Thats why i told you to try an alliance with sov.
If you think its fun to "ninjarat" thats fine by me, but its a very ineffective way to make isk. From a perspective of isk/hr it is stupid do do what you do.
Quote:
When a "hunter" comes into system he's like a hungry man entering a restaurant. Local is like a menu. Does a menu benefit the hungry hunter or does it benefit the steak? It benefits the hunter.
It benefits both equally.
Without local the hunter in a cov ops is effectively invisible unless you keep 24/7 scouts on gates. He will know the good ratting systems, and within a few seconds a decent cov ops pilot will find you in your belt using the directional scanner. Beeing invisible he can chose the moment to uncloak and put a point on you before his gang warps to him.
Quote:
Smart pilots will benefit from the change to local. Dumb pilots will suffer from the removal of the training wheels. I fly with smart pilots. We can't wait for this to happen.
Sorry smart pilots will put their alts in empire as its much more efficient to get isk that way for their pvp ships. You dont have to be smart to stay safe, just tolerate a lot of boredom and be willing to earn **** isk/hr. Even in good ratting systems with easy access to stations its barely worth it compared to lvl 4 missions.
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Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.21 09:31:00 -
[7]
Originally by: wtbrandomnamegenerator
Patrols.
Seriously, it sounds silly, but its good for the game.
To safely and confidently control space, your going to need to patrol your space. Period.
Patrols would be horribly inefficient and miss most of the gangs.
No you need dedicated scout accounts on gates. Maybe alliances will have to use their moongold on scout accounts and make some sort of intelbot. |
Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.21 16:54:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Mikayla Grey on 21/06/2009 16:55:29
Originally by: Neutrino Sunset
Originally by: Mikayla Grey
No you need dedicated scout accounts on gates. Maybe alliances will have to use their moongold on scout accounts and make some sort of intelbot.
I suspect your point is an attempt at reverse psychology. Separate accounts monitored by bots being both metagaming and an exploit is obviously not a solution to a failing game mechanic that is going to be acceptable to the majority of the players, let alone CCP.
I would very much like it if in a no local environment patrols would provide a reasonable measure of security, without changes to the scanning/cloaking mechanics though I don't see how they would.
Call it what you like but I will be surprised if it dont happen if local is removed. Who cares if its metagaming and a exploit. Macro ratters are the same, and scouting on gates would be a lot more boring than ratting. Similar stuff has already been tried by alliances. It wont be long until the tools are there.
Patrols will never provide adequate security. |
Mikayla Grey
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.21 23:08:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Pan Crastus The delayed local is the best solution IMO.
If you think it's too dangerous for ratters who are watching local now - you're trying to solve the wrong problem. You don't keep your space safe by watching local, you do it by keeping hostiles out, patrolling etc. So if hostiles enter your system, it's perfectly fine if they can find you quickly.
You dont keep your space by patrolling. You keep your space by POS warfare. Most alliance pilots already have high sec isk grinders so maybe it wont matter much that 0.0 is just a pos bashing arena.
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